1972-d DDR-001,DDO-1

BillSanders

1972-d DDR-001,DDO-1

Post by BillSanders » Sun Sep 28, 2008 12:39 pm

Last week I found this nice DD in a circulated group of 16 IKE's I bought from a dealer for 1.25 each. This group was a nice looking lot of 1972's P & D's. I like searching through coins (like I did as a kid 50 years ago).
I believe this is a 1972-d DDR-1,DDO-1. The B & 1 have split serifs on the obverse. The islands are doubled & the S's have split serif's on the reverse. It also has pronounced MDD on the letters of one dollar. Plus the O on the reverse has a die crack which shows a "tail" ponting up on the top left. Please pardon by pictures, I used a digital camera though a loop.
Does anyone know how rare this coin is?
Please look at the pictures below and let me know what you think.
Bill
ddr1.jpg
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ddrearth1.jpg
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ddrt1.jpg
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ddrs1.jpg
ddrs1.jpg (47.09 KiB) Viewed 1562 times
ddrone1.jpg
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Attachments
ddrb1.jpg
ddrb1.jpg (59.39 KiB) Viewed 1560 times
ddro1.jpg
ddro1.jpg (7.48 KiB) Viewed 1561 times

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foundinrolls
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Re: 1972-d DDR-001,DDO-1

Post by foundinrolls » Mon Nov 10, 2008 2:26 am

Hi,

I recently found two of these. They seem to be LDS and circulated. One has strong machine doubling damage on the reverse as well as the die doubling. The strong splits on the S's of STATES helped me to ID the pieces. Then the shapes of the letters of E PLURIBUS UNUM gave me a sign. I only wish that they were in better shape. The obverses of both coins shows the same doubling as the coin pictured above.

Thanks,
Bill O'

BillSanders

Re: 1972-d DDR-001,DDO-1

Post by BillSanders » Mon Nov 10, 2008 8:35 am

Welcome Bill, to the Ike Forum,
Does either (or both) of your coins have the die crack in the O 0n the top left in OF and are the Islands doubled on the reverse? Plus the notches in the fist 1 of the date and the split serif on the B? I love the doubling on this coin. Wexler and Wiles both have good pictures in their books for comparison. If you could post some pictures we would love to see them.
Bill

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Re: 1972-d DDR-001,DDO-1

Post by foundinrolls » Mon Nov 10, 2008 6:17 pm

Hi Bill,

Both coins have the notch on the lower Serif of the B.

Both have notches on the first 1 of the date. On one, though you really have to get it at just the right angle to see it because of the later die state. Also, on both the notches resemble machine doubling damage but an experienced eye would know that they are notches. Still the notches are difficult to see because of the later die state but they are there.

On the reverse, both have the Doubled Islands.

Both have the die break on the O of OF in the place that you describe.

I would tend to call it a die chip.

On one, it appears at the upper left of the O in the field but stops where the O starts.

On the other, it appears to be in the same position as the first coin but the chip seems to extend onto the the actual letter as well.

I seldom get a chance to "play" with Ikes and what I know about them would fit in a thimble:-) Thanks for pointing out the other characteristics of this die variety.

I'll try to get some pictures going. I only wish they were better coins.

Thanks,
Bill

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Re: 1972-d DDR-001,DDO-1

Post by foundinrolls » Mon Nov 10, 2008 9:43 pm

Hi All,
Here is a composite of all the attributes that were mentioned. I did the best I could quickly:-)

Reverse:
You can see the notches on the letters of E PLURIBUS UNUM.
You can see doubled islands on the "world".
You can see the die break (chip) on the "O" of "OF". (What looked raised on one of them was a scratch that made it look like the surface of the "O" was involved on one of the coins.)

Obverse:
You can see a Split Serif on the bottom of the "B" of LIBERTY.
Barely visible due to the die state is a split on the inside, upper portion of the numeral "1".

I must say that this is an incredible learning experience:-) Little known is that many moons ago, I was one of the first to make dealers aware of doubled dies on Ikes but then I got into other things. I am thrilled to see how far this has come along.

By the way, they all thought I was nuts as noone was paying attention to die varieties back then:-)

This is an excellent forum.

Thank You,

Bill O'

Image

BillSanders

Re: 1972-d DDR-001,DDO-1

Post by BillSanders » Mon Nov 10, 2008 10:12 pm

Fantistic pictures,Bill.
Your coins both look like mine. Wiles (Conena Attribution Guide (1997)) lists it on page 40 , as 1972D DDO-1 and on page48 as 1972D DDR-1 with "stage C Die chip outside upper O of OF".
I love this doubling and wonder if you know how rare it is? Wiles in 1997 listed it as URS1,4 (urs-4=5 to 8 known).
Bill

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Re: 1972-d DDR-001,DDO-1

Post by foundinrolls » Mon Nov 10, 2008 11:49 pm

Hi Bill,

Is that a rhetorical question:-) or are you really asking me if I know how rare these are? :-)

There is an equation that applies to my knowledge of Eisenhower die variety attributions and rarity at this point.

If X= my knowledge of particulars....X - 5 = I know less than "diddly"

It might be bad math but that's where I'm at.

I know what I'm looking at and can describe it in great detail but I don't have any of the Ike references.

I can always ask James what he knows of the rarity of these. What I find though is that establishing a rarity on any die variety can be tough as there is no way, sometimes , to get a handle on how many of something is really out there. For example, I have 55, 1983 DDO cents that were a new discovery about 6 years ago. Very few people even know they exist. The only person who really knows how rare they are is me and one other person and he passed away.

What is being provided here is a fantastic learning experience on Eisenhower Dollars for me:-)

Thanks,
Bill

BillSanders

Re: 1972-d DDR-001,DDO-1

Post by BillSanders » Tue Nov 11, 2008 8:27 am

Hi Bill,
Well, we now know there is 3 with DDO-001 & DDR-001's and counting. I think James Wiles became interested in other Series after 1997 so I do not know how relevant his information is today. I like using his published work (1997) as a source for developing my thinking on Ike Doubling though his work is probably out of date. He is very methodical in developing his cataloging system. If you know him, it may be helpful to ask him if he has any more current information to add.
Thanks, Bill

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Re: 1972-d DDR-001,DDO-1

Post by foundinrolls » Tue Nov 11, 2008 6:29 pm

Hi,

I am checking with Dr. Wiles and will let you know what I find out.

Have Fun,
Bill

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Re: 1972-d DDR-001,DDO-1

Post by foundinrolls » Fri Nov 14, 2008 1:31 am

Hi All,

James knows of approximately 10 of these pieces. He personally likes these and he indicates that finding an EDS piece would be a great find.

Have Fun,
Bill O'

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