I FOUND ANOTHER PPL, I think

Post Reply
User avatar
robEzerman
Posts: 849
Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2008 2:26 pm
Contact:

I FOUND ANOTHER PPL, I think

Post by robEzerman » Mon Dec 01, 2008 3:32 pm

NGC 71-S PF 65 UC. Strong Ike, should make PR69DCAM if cracked and subbed to PCGS.

I just noticed that the reverse has a fabulous "strike". This may make sense. If the obverse shallow die takes less planchet metal to form its central device then there would be a relative surplus for the reverse Eagle and "left over" strike pressure to stuff that die.

The Earth and the Eagle just fly off the mirror fields and the Earth has full cameo.

This PPL (I'm calling it that even though this topic is to gather opinions, is it a PPL?) does not have full translucency of the "O" at at 6PM but in my scope I can make out two field polish lines under that segment of the O.

Over-all it has the shallow obverse devices that are the PPL's Hallmarks, do you agree? Rob
Attachments
DSCN8519-1.JPG
DSCN8518-1.JPG
DSCN8517-1.JPG
DSCN8516-1.JPG
DSCN8515-1.JPG
DSCN8514-1.JPG
DSCN8513-1.JPG
DSCN8512-1.JPG
Now is the time to cherry Ikes. Lots of fruit still on the trees but don't wait too long. Rob Ezerman

Sumdunce
Posts: 387
Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2008 2:41 pm
Contact:

Re: I FOUND ANOTHER PPL, I think

Post by Sumdunce » Mon Dec 01, 2008 8:24 pm

Nice.

I have been looking at the proofs lately and have not found anything interesting.

Grats on the find.

V/R



LaMont
Eschew obfuscation!

User avatar
robEzerman
Posts: 849
Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2008 2:26 pm
Contact:

Re: I FOUND ANOTHER PPL, I think

Post by robEzerman » Mon Dec 01, 2008 10:36 pm

I think the pictures support PPL - even the S of TRUST is diminutive.

I have 60+ 71-S Ike proofs to go through when I've completed two assignments that are way late getting done, that will be fun, all either fading peg legs, full peg legs or with some other interesting obvious attribute like cool toning. Hope to find one of Lee's strong DDO's and maybe another PPL, but probably won't :( . Rob
Now is the time to cherry Ikes. Lots of fruit still on the trees but don't wait too long. Rob Ezerman

AaronMiller

Re: I FOUND ANOTHER PPL, I think

Post by AaronMiller » Tue Dec 02, 2008 1:47 pm

Yes, this has all the PPL characteristics. I wonder though if there should be a grading/attribution scale for these. Some have the O in GOD completely split with the field running through, while others are not split with no frost or slight frost. Perhaps a system similar to the Ike Group's A/B/C scale for die clashes would be beneficial?

A = O fully sunk into field
B = O partially sunk, no frost
C = O slightly sunk, slight frost

Also, I am in favor of a new name for these weak/partially hubbed varieties. The PPL label has been around for a long time and is well understood by collectors. Unfortunately, PPL does not translate well to Serif R pieces which have a visible serif AND all the other PPL characteristics. Most of the characteristics of the weakly hubbed obverse have nothing to do with the R at all, yet it is known as a Peg Leg. In another thread I posted a 73-S Proof that I feel fits all the weak hub PPL descriptors (except it is not technically a peg leg), and I hear rumor at least one 71-S Serif R Proof exhibits these characteristics as well.

What does everyone think?

Aaron

AaronMiller

Re: I FOUND ANOTHER PPL, I think

Post by AaronMiller » Tue Dec 02, 2008 2:30 pm

Here is a link to the 1973-S Proof I mentioned above...

http://ikegroup.sslpowered.com/ikegroup ... 2d1b2a11dc

Aaron

User avatar
robEzerman
Posts: 849
Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2008 2:26 pm
Contact:

Re: I FOUND ANOTHER PPL, I think

Post by robEzerman » Tue Dec 02, 2008 7:29 pm

Aaron, glad you've rised this issue. The name for our family of weakly hubbed dies begs other questions:
- in '71 the proof dies were unique, hence the PPL stands out;
- in '72, the proof and SB dies were theoretically the same;
- in '73 and on, the proof and SB and circulation dies were theoretically taken from the same pool of dies, right?
The first question is whether Ike proof dies are in fact simply dies taken from the pool of dies made at Philly, possibly "better dies", and test polished at Philly before being punched with the "S" mintmark, but still taken from the same die pool? Our research on the linked 72-S SI and the 72 T-2 support a common pool of dies but it would be nice to find additional evidence.

The second question is whether we would recognize a weakly hubbed die used to strike 72 SB, and, 73 SB and CBIkes? Without the proof polishing treatment, it's possible the marker open "O" would stay closed: without the fading peg leg R and open "O". we're left with an open "9" (I think) and lopsided "T" of TRUST as markers but we have not been looking for these markers hence we may have missed examples.

Let's start looking: theoretically we should find partially hubed Ikes across the series.

By the way, the rumored 71-S serif-R "PPL" proof should arrive by Friday. Rob

I enlarged my photo of the "O" and was glad to see that several die-polish lines show up. I wonder if this feature should be a marker of Grade A or whatever system we choose?
Now is the time to cherry Ikes. Lots of fruit still on the trees but don't wait too long. Rob Ezerman

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest